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Thread: [SOLVED] Maximum message size

  1. #1
    KenVM is offline Active Member
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    Default [SOLVED] Maximum message size

    Hey folks,

    I'm having a problem with the Maximum message size not being honored.

    Current settings in the Admin -> Global Settings -> MTA:

    Maximum message size (kb):* 10240
    Maximum size of an uploaded file(kb):* 10240

    If I use Imap/Thunderbird to upload a file that is: 8,987 KB I get a message:

    "The size of the message you are trying to send exceeds the global size limit (10485760 bytes) of the server. The message was not sent, try to reduce the message size and try again."

    If I use the web client, I get the error:

    Could not send message: mail.SEND_FAILURE

    msg - SMTP server reported: null
    code - mail.SEND_FAILURE
    method - ZmCsfeCommand.prototype.invoke
    detail - soap:Sender
    data - [object Object]

    Anything over roughly 6MB fails to upload.

    Any ideas on whats going on?

    Thanks,

    -Ken

  2. #2
    mmorse's Avatar
    mmorse is offline Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmorse View Post
    So, you might to set zimbraFileUploadMaxSize 10-30% > than your attachment.
    Also as a general rule, I set zimbraMtaMaxMessageSize 10% larger than the zimbraFileUploadMaxSize.

    If I understand this right...say both are set to 10MB (and you tell everyone they can send 10MB attachments):
    An email with a 9MB attachment and 100KB message body text. The attachment may be less than the 10MB zimbraFileUploadMaxSize, and so it'll get accepted by the file upload system. But when it's converted into a MIME message it ends up base64-encoded. Then add 100K of regular body text, and the resulting message (say 10.3MB or so) is then handed off to postfix, which checks zimbraMtaMaxMessageSize and promptly rejects the message if it's over the limit of 10MB.

    Of course that would mean that you would set zimbraMtaMaxMessageSize even larger if you want to allow emails with multiple large attachments.
    What are the attachments of (that their getting so big on conversion) ?

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    mmorse's Avatar
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  4. #4
    KenVM is offline Active Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmorse View Post
    What are the attachments of (that their getting so big on conversion) ?
    I've tried with both a tar.gz and an exe file. I'm not sure what the user that noticed the problem was originally trying to transfer though.

    The first two bugs aren't the issue, but the third 16225 looks to be the same issue.

    Thanks,

    -Ken

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    mmorse's Avatar
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    The first two are about fixing the error message in the web-client so it's more descriptive.
    Last edited by mmorse; 11-02-2007 at 03:53 PM. Reason: 'two' not 'to'

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    Default MIME inflation may explain this. . .

    You may not be dealing with a bug at all, Ken. Remember that when a binary attachment is sent by email it is first encoded into ASCII using either MIME or UUENCODE. Either results in fairly substantial inflation in message size, as explained in this article.

    Let's look at your specific example. You have a file that you tell us is 8,987 KB. Multiply that by 1,024 bytes per KB and you have 9,202,688 bytes. Now give that a 30% encoding overhead (the article I referenced says 30-40%) and you're up to 11,963,494 bytes. Sticking with kilobytes, though, since that's how the Zimbra system takes its settings, 8,987 kb times 30% inflation would be 11,683 KB, again over your stated limits.

    Let's do a real-world test. I have a message in my inbox that is reported by Zimbra as 10,544 KB. It's got only two lines of text, and a PDF attachment. When I save that attachment to my desktop and check its size with Windows, the resultant file is only 7.47 MB (7,835,426 bytes).

    Bottom line--file size and message size should not be confused. If you really want to limit your users to 10MB attachments, you probably need to limit the message size to more like 13 or 14 MB to allow that file size to come through. This is not a bug, it's how encoding of binary attachments works.

    Hope this helps,

    Dan

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    mmorse's Avatar
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    I think the thought on Bug 16225 - Discrepancy between zimbraFileUploadMaxSize and the actual upload size was to prevent anyone from setting 'FileUpload' less than 'MtaMax'

    And if that is implemented, then this will need to be done: Bug 19515 - Separate Max File Size for Briefcase

    ----
    UPDATE: See later post on why this should be warn instead of prevent! /forums/administrators/12600-maximum-message-size-2.html#post64950
    Last edited by mmorse; 11-05-2007 at 02:01 PM. Reason: don't want to prevent

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    Quote Originally Posted by mmorse View Post
    I think the thought on Bug 16225 - Discrepancy between zimbraFileUploadMaxSize and the actual upload size was to prevent anyone from setting 'FileUpload' less than 'MtaMax'

    And if that is implemented, then this will need to be done: Bug 19515 - Separate Max File Size for Briefcase
    Could be. I don't see enough detail in the bug description to know for sure, unless there is some back-channel communication that didn't make it onto the public boards. The way I read it was the same as Ken's concern--he set the max size to one thing, and then got stuffed uploading messages that were smaller than that thing. It's a common frustration, actually.

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    mmorse's Avatar
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    Your totally right I just assumed that it was when I saw:
    Maximum upload-able file size differs from (is less than) zimbraFileUploadMaxSize.
    It seems there's just too many of those 'attachment size' bugs out there -lol- I feel really sorry for the guys who have to clean up bugzilla sometimes...

    Unfortunately, only the reporter or zimbra employees can mark dupes/close. Though for good reason, because they don't want skip any NE user's concern.
    It's great when people hit the forums first so we can prevent duplicates. But there's still a large number of people who just try to get all their problems answered in bugzilla because they know that a zimbra employee will definitely see the content sometime. (Where as the forums are optional to employees.)

    Of course, it would be cool if bugzilla would be upgraded to a newer/easier to navigate version; but that ain't gonna happen anytime soon, because there's waaay too much custom stuff built in for internal use.
    Last edited by mmorse; 11-02-2007 at 04:37 PM.

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    If it gets reported that often, should we have a sticky thread (this one or another) that explains the ways of MIME so those who ARE inclined to read first have a hint? I know it's elementary to the old salts, but there are plenty of folks out there who don't know about it. . .

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